Sorry Keith we'll never know. They buy those phones that you pay minutes for. That way there's no contract or paper trail to follow them.  This guy is pretty slick of knowing just what to say. I messed with him for several hours one day. I played along with him, even acted like I went to the bank to get the money and called him back and then acted like I went to 4 different places to wire him the money. I figured I kept him from trying to scam another person by keeping him on the phone.   : )